Parents, brother and his wife are very upset with me. Advice?

They are on denial with unrealistic way of looking at things. What were you supposed to do if the were not cooperating?

In your home you have a right to clean up unsanitary conditions without needing anyones blessing or approval.  Quite frankly I wouldn't care if they were offended or not.  Your mom is incontinent and is in denial about the situation and everyone is trying to tip toe around the obvious.  If it were my home, I would have said you need to keep yourself clean and letting urine run down your leg and not feeling the need to do anything about it is unacceptable.  It makes me think there may be mental decline with your mom as well. 

Maybe you need to visit them instead of them coming to your home...

Hey, you went out of your way to entertain family. Perhaps they should say thanks and not criticize you for trying to protect your surroundings. If your mom were thinking straight she’d realize you were trying to help her, too. Parents DO NOT want to have accidents and cause additional work for their children. It’s embarrassing & degrading, but that does not mean you pretend it’s not happening. We bought big waterproof bed pads that can be machine washed. We put them on the bed, favorite chairs & even on the wheelchair. Made a great difference! Said they were two fold: kept seat from getting wet and provided some added padding for comfort…Never came up with a great fix for potty seat messes. Keeping a mop nearby is smart. You can always quietly tell your mom you’re trying to preserve her dignity and allow her to help with the situation. If she’s unable to reason & understand that, then you’ll just have to do the best you can. We bought Depends pull ups in dark colors for my dad when he became incontinent. At first he balked, but then realized they helped him have very few accidents! There are attractive pull ups for women too. A little more expensive, but they don’t look like diapers & help keep a person from having frequent accidents. Regarding showers, both my folks hit points where they thought they didn’t need them. I told them they were offensive smelling and they must shower three days a week. I offered to help or pay to have someone come in and help if they didn’t want me to. They opted for an aide until they were too far gone into AZ to really care. You’ll want to have a blunt conversation with family members & tell them it’s about dealing with “the now” & realizing that keeps changing, so your responses must too! You can help your situation and give Mom back some dignity- how can that be a problem? Good luck & God bless. It’s really tough watching a LO go downhill.

It sounds like Mom is in denial (and embarrassed) about her incontinence. If she’s of sound mind and refuses underwear or anything else to help, she likely doesn’t think it’s a problem?

It’s so common I think particularly with women that have born children, at least from what I’m told and it less s the blow, for people as they age to have accidents. It often starts out as those little accidents that happen when we sneeze or cough or simply the recognition of urgency and we wait too long, all of which usually get worse. The unfortunate coincidence is that our sense of smell and taste often diminish as we age too and the combination is a recipe for repealing everyone else and being totally unaware of just how bad it’s gotten. Couple that with denial and embarrassment, well you have the situation you were presented with. I don’t love going to my mom’s the way I used to because her room and bathroom often reek of urine, she doesn’t smell it (she’s also adjusted to it I think) if we don’t prod her to keep up with the wet bed pads and clothing. But my mom wears Depends, happily and is aware of her incontinence, is embarrassed by accidents when others are around. My brother and I often clean up and or put reusable bed pads down on furniture and car seats which she used to fight but doesn’t anymore, she absolutely did at first and I understand why. I am embarrassed for her when I have to put a pad down on the couch when she’s visiting for a family get together but it’s better than the alternative.

My guess is your mom is still in the denial stage and being aided in staying there by your dad first and foremost. Your SIL has followed suit. I’m not sure who told you the problem had gotten better prior to them arriving but I’m sure this is far easier for mom to believe than admitting to herself that it’s gotten worse. It’s too bad they have now left but you are very fortunate to have SIL there and someone I’m assuming mom feels comfortable with and trusts? Perhaps one or both of you having a “private” conversation with mom about it being a very common problem for women who have born children (an important accomplishment) so much so that they have perfected and make both disposable and reusable underwear for this problem. How about we try some different versions and see what you like (simply buying new underwear)? You mentioned that she was often not wearing any underwear is this something she has always done or is this a new thing? I keep a package of depends in every family bathroom so mom doesn’t have to advertise by taking her purse, bag or a new pair in every time she goes. This way when she doesn’t know her underwear is wet she doesn’t have to “hide” it. While cleaning up and taking care of your home is the only thing you should do Leaving the mop in the bathroom, putting down puppy pads was probably too obvious a reminder for both your parents and Dad responded with misdirected anger, Mom may have too. This is a process and a sensitive one, I can only guess that your brothers approach is only making her and your dad dig in more and ignore the problem. If she with you and your SIL help we’re taking care of it and dad could be left semi in the dark my guess is everyone would be better for it.

That said I agree it sounds like brother & SIL are reaching burn out he just doesn’t express it so it comes out in very bad ways. Again a guess but the “family” religion mentioned probably has something to do with this. Sounds like men learn to be dominant and feel superior no matter how caring their nature. Also sounds like you have found your path through this even if Dad isn’t happy with that path. I’m not clear on your relationship with your SIL but if it’s good that’s where I might start. I don’t think it’s your responsibility to go to or even acknowledge your brothers tirade other than to acknowledge they may be overloaded and perhaps your SIL is the place to start?

They are lucky to have you, the special, loving, understanding and evolved person you are and you are so fortunate to have found the ability to maintain a relationship with them. We can all learn from your example & I think it’s worth it.

The first thing I thought was this is not hygienic at all. It cannot be acceptable to let anyone pee all over the place! Then I read about the poop stain on her dress, oh dear. Your mom needs help and the rest of the family is probably in denial. How can they just go along with this? Car rides in which mom freely “goes” and others must deal with it! It’s not sanitary. Get depends at the very least, pads for any places she sits and someone needs to accompany her to the restroom. When my DH started getting incontinent I quickly learned that I had to replace all of his undershorts with depends, otherwise he would put on his normal underwear and inevitably there would be accidents. If they ever come for a visit again you need to lay down some ground rules. Yes, they are your parents but you are a grown adult and sometimes the child has to become the parent.

I hope that being able to come here are write how you feel has helped you, clearly you like to keep your home nice, but there is a difference between what you notice and what your family members notice. It is difficult to deal with accidents had by guests and different responsibilities fall on each side. No doubt your family members are very aware and embarrassed by accidents and so your clearing up makes them feel worse - but they are in some ways their own worst enemies. Mother should be wearing depend pants and this is something they should be sorting out if they expect to take her out - it is no good them trying to let her "get away with" not wearing necessary protection if she is going out - if she refuses then they should not be taking her. OK maybe you are a bit fussy (so would I be) but it is your home and you have to decide what you will put up with, but also how you can deal with things in a way not to make an embarrassing situation worse for others. Before any future visits I think you have to lay down your rules for your house, and your family certainly have to get mother to wear suitable protection - would they let her pee in in appropriate places in someone else's house or do they think you should have different standards to other people or to restaurants etc. For now personally I would leave any discussion for a couple of weeks until feelings are not running as high, but something needs doing their end - how they manage making mother wear something suitable is up to them, but if they can't and they are happy to clear up constantly then maybe you have to visit them not vice versa. It has to be dealt with - only you can decide if you and they can reach agreement or if you eventually have to report that she is not being cared for properly, or consult an elder lawyer over getting her an adequate level of care. Not being devisive may not be an option.

It sounds to me like this brought matters to a head. Even though you are getting flack for this, it isn't acceptable to enable a person with dementia to pee anywhere they like! That is the reality.
It is not you who is unreasonable. I love the comment suggesting if they think it is alright they must all have UTIs and delirium! There is an alternative reality going on with your brother and his wife!
Good luck. xx

Pee on slate floors is a slip hazard.

Everyone but you has a UTI and delirium if they think it's ok to pee on the floor and not clean it up right away.



Order some pretty Silhouettes from Amazon and have it delivered to their house.

Oh but yes. Your brother and his wife are burnt out. Forgive them. And yourself. No one is a bad guy here. Not even mom or dad. As we age many things diminish. Judgement can be one of them.

Knowingly, if even accidental, elimination of body waste is more than poor hygiene, its uncivilized. You are completely justified to not want your home to be used as a litter box. There is no justification for her to not wear protective briefs and liners. Besides that, is she incapable of cleaning up after herself? What did they expect you to do, wait until your home was an open septic tank? A person who doesn't care when or where they eliminate, shuns bathing, and can't distinguish her body odor needs a thorough medical and mental evaluation exam. Sounds like that won't happen. The family's attitude is shameful and enabling. You did nothing wrong.

You have very right to be upset with your mom, brother and sister-in-law.
My mom has similar incontinence issues. She can only come over with a fresh Depend on and extra ones in a backpack. Your brother should pay for a professional cleaning of your house and furniture. The fact that my child (even adult child) was contacted in such an underhanded way would enrage me.

At the age both your parents are, how do you even know that Dad was not....

Things you can't control: where and when an incontinent person pees, other people's feelings.

What you can control: who stays at your house.

If anyone complains to you about their free lodgings or their hurt feelings (and third party feelings to boot!) say "I'm sorry the visit didn't go well it won't happen again". Because if someone wants to visit your town again they can act like adults and get a hotel.

I have to be misreading your post after getting off work. So forgive me if I’m missing something. This happened in your home and you were to apologize or pretend this was not happening. Why don’t you rest a while, do not call anyone!! Families can be so draining. I know from personal experience.

I remember holding a party one time after adding on to our home and invited my siblings, nieces, and nephews who all in turn brought their other half (you get me). Some person (no elder at this party) not only peed in our bathroom trashcan but also on the floor and toilet. We haven’t held an event at our home since. We were furious!

I’m sorry that your mom is having this issue but it must be addressed. I always had my parents wear two incontinence products. In our vehicles we have a trash bag on the bottom, then an underpad, and a towel we can just throw away on top to make it all look pretty (probably a more effective way). Change of clothes, etc. Thankfully parents never objected. In our home or their home, every few hours it was time for the restroom just to keep them from soaking through.

When they use to say but my asthma due to using air fresher, well I have allergies against stink is what I use to say and that objection stopped once we found something we could agree on. My sister, the live in sibling, use to have no problem with pea smelling floors but my nose would pick up as soon as I hit the door and then it was like mop, bleach, and go at it until it was no more.

And I’m no hell raiser but don’t keep pushing me! I heard TD Jakes quoting someone quite a while ago now but he said and I’ll never forget, “peace at any price (or at any cost – I believe he said)  is no peace at all.” Sure he was quoting someone else but it has been very helpful in my life. I think on it when I have issues in my marriage, on the job, with the siblings - life. God, guide my tongue but let me not push down my feelings any longer.

With all that being said, I smell something fishy! I’m wondering if something is about to be dumped in your lap whether it be you convincing mom to wear the products or just take over completely. Like by having you feel guilty about this visit to the point of taking completely over the responsibility.

Good luck to you! Again if I’m not reading your post correctly forgive me.

KeepthePeace,
I love your screen name.
It appears to be who you are.
A peacemaker.

I wonder if your Dad's "religion" includes in the bible:
Matthew 5:9
Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called the children of God.

If you studied the bible, and have rejected "religion", that is understandable.
Peacemakers are not appeasers, imo.

A good peacemaker gives up the right to revenge. You don't show an ounce of revenge, imo.

You are the "scapegoat" of the family. You do not need to be that.
Whether you believe or not believe, God is blessing you.

Just caught up on the posts since I replied. Your brother and wife live with your parents and wife is a nurse! I cannot imagine putting up with Mom day in and day out. I am so bad when it comes to smells. I knew as soon as I walked in my door my cat had gone someplace and I always found it.

I really have to give your SIL credit. No way would I live with someone with Moms habit. As a nurse must be hard getting thru to Mom that she needs help.

I would not allow her to visit again until she sees a doctor. And I would tell her that. Sometimes the elderly think its just part of getting old. It is, but treatable.

Keeping,

I have read your responses and you come across as a person who wishes to have a harmonious relationship with your family. Don’t we all want harmonious relationships? No one enjoys conflict. Well, some dysfunctional people thrive on conflict, For the most part though, people striving to have healthy relationships, would rather avoid conflict. There are times though, where conflict is inevitably going to occur. In these cases, speak your mind. His religious views shouldn’t come into play. That is neither here nor there.

This isn’t about religion. It’s about having mutual respect for each other. Anyone who tries to make this about religion is either totally misguided or using religion to shame or punish. Do not accept that from your father.

It’s not a fair or valid contribution to bring religion to the table and use it as emotional blackmail. It is quite annoying when people feel like they know who God is going to send to hell. God is not a big bully in sky.

God gave us a brain to reason with and free will to make wise choices. Let’s hope your dad will learn to make better choices in life, rather than to upset his daughter. Although, most people his age are set in their ways. It’s no wonder why you don’t follow their religion.

I know a woman that is constantly preaching her hellfire and damnation. None of her children follow her faith either. She chased them away. This kind of preaching is counterproductive. Plus, you are a grown woman who has the right to follow whatever beliefs that are important to you.

I respect all faiths but your dad’s faith doesn’t give him the right to beat you over the head with a Bible. The Bible does speak about judgment but it also speaks about love and mercy.

Wishing you all the best.

‘Keeping the peace’ attitude never works! Implementing solutions works. Keeping the peace’ is stifling our own emotions and allowing ourselves to become a doormat. You are not your brother’s doormat. He was out of line by calling you out.

Your brother didn’t care about keeping the peace. He was rude and insulting to you. He wasn’t even logical. Mom changed your diapers because that is what mom’s are supposed to do! That doesn’t give her a free pass to pee all over your home now.

Your brother is getting fed up with caring for your parents and is taking his frustrations out on you.

Trust me, I empathize with him for being frustrated with the situation but his jumping on you was extremely unfair to you. What on earth did he want you to do? Smile and be happy with the situation? I don’t know anyone who would have not been upset by pee all over their home.

All siblings have ups and downs. Same with parents and children, there will always disagreements, but it is not your responsibility to ‘keep the peace.’ Besides, they were guests in your home. Guests should be considerate of those who have generously invited them to stay in their homes.

I wouldn’t say anything to him. He didn’t listen before, so let him cool off and process the situation. I hope that he will contact you to apologize but I wouldn’t hold my breath. I hope that this will be a lesson for them and the issues will be addressed.

If they realize they have been handling this situation all wrong, then put the whole unpleasant experience behind you. If they are blasé about it, so be it. Still, don’t make a fuss about it. Carry on in your own life. You can’t change their behavior. Be at peace knowing that you haven’t done anything that was inappropriate.

I don’t understand why he would contact your daughter either. Why place her in the middle of this? I bet she didn’t appreciate being put in the middle.

If there is a next visit, they can make reservations at a lovely hotel nearby.

I’d choose the most sensible person in the group, and post them a pair of Depends. The letter with them should say that the usual advice is to remove all the ‘normal’ knickers and replace them with Depends (or whatever brand you chose), so that mother has no choice.

Say that following that very common advice will remove the embarrassment for everyone, as well as the need to clean up all the time. You can add that you like a clean house, and you’re sorry that all of this has caused so much unnecessary stress for everyone.

You are doing the right thing - I'd ignore complaints. And if they did not want you to clean, then did THEY clean up after mom? If not, why not? I'd be grateful for your patience and I would try to wear appropriate underwear.

You have as much right to clean your own house as your mother does to pee in her own car;) Unless she has dementia, it's really rude to go visiting and not wear the proper undergarments (and then expect you to not clean up the accidents??) It sounds like your brother regrets his decision to move in with the parents and is unloading on you, as he thinks you have it 'easy.' Don't accept his abuse, continue to do what you reasonably can for your parents--but never live with them.

What a horrible 2 week "vacation"!

Maybe write a letter to mom and whoever else you want to communicate with? I'd write one to mom and assume that everyone else will read it, so write it for their benefit as well.

Do NOT apologize. Tell your mom that it was nice to see her. That you were surprised at her level of incontinence, indicating there could be something wrong. Tell her that there are very nice products these days that are just like underwear that can help protect her and her home from the urine. That you are concerned that maybe there is something wrong that is causing it to be difficult to control her peeing. Like a UTI which is difficult to identify in the elderly - need a urine test. Maybe she should go to a urologist.

Don't let brother make you feel bad. If they didn't like it that you did not appreciate her peeing all over your bathrooms, too bad. He lied to you about her level of incontinence, so that's on him. You could have been prepared and had some Always pullups or Depends on hand and let them know in advance that you would be expecting her to wear them. It is NOT acceptable to let someone go to the bathroom inappropriately without at least TRYING to remedy the situation. I know my mom had a pee accident a few weeks ago and I was mortified and am so glad that is was an isolated incident since I WILL not tolerate that in my home except in the rarest of situations. It will be grounds for moving to AL it were to become a regular event.

Memo to ANYONE who has EVER taken care of a geriatric adult who is incontinent- DO NOT EVER BECOME THE VICTIM OF SOMEONE WHO SAYS “THEY WIPED YOUR BUTT”.

NOT EVER. Children LEARN to use the toilet and parents are RESPONSIBLE FOR TEACHING THEM TO DO SO.

Your mother lied to you by implying that she had more control than she wanted to admit. She CHOSE to neglect herself even when help was politely offered.

I’m betting “brother” really put it on the line in the car.

DO NOT suffer over this. Your mother is demonstrating behaviors that are serious and have social repercussions.

If they are now home, leave these two weeks behind you. Don’t dwell on them.

Advise? Ignore the whole episode.

I have a feeling the only person who got offended was your mom and she probably took it out on your brother the entire way home...so he in turn tried to take it out on you. Every time my father used my bathroom I had to race in there and clean up after him. Took all the fun out of having people over for the holidays if I was on constant 'pee patrol'.

Do not apologize. She owes you one. Who thinks that is ok to do? Stop chasing after her and wait until she calls you. If she starts in on you....you need to take the lead and tell her peeing in your home is not acceptable and there are precautions she can take. Don't let her push this back on you as if you did something wrong.

Show her the commercial with the lady who has just got out of bed and is in the bathroom looking at the mirror. She mentions she takes care of "that skin" then ends by saying to the camera "You're still here?.."

Funny, confident and lack of embarrassment.

First, I'm very sorry that your visit was thrown off the tracks because of your mom's incontinence.

Secondly, please don't take the following as a criticism of you and your wanting to clean up as soon as possible after mom's accidents, because besides from the horrible smell, it's just so incredibly unsanitary for everyone in the house. It is perfectly reasonable to want to clean up as soon as possible, and you did nothing wrong in that respect.

Are your brother and his wife doing a lot of caring for your parents? I assume from your post that they live close by each other?

I only ask because your brother's reaction just seems so over the top to me, so I have to wonder if he's bearing the brunt of this issue with mom. For example, if mom is showing cognitive decline, she might be harping and harping on what happened at your house to your brother and his wife. There might be no distracting her from it, and it might, in turn, be making your brother's life problematic. This is in no way an excusal for your brother taking it out on YOU, mind you, but it might explain HIS reaction to this. Because, a normal reaction to what happened really should be "wow, that's disgusting, I can't blame my sister for cleaning up as fast as she can" - but his reaction seems more like "I can't believe my sister acted in this way that's making my life so much more difficult!".

You said your brother called and "had a lot to say". Was it all about this incontinence issue?  His comments to you about you should be willing to "put up with it" because they "wiped your butt" as a baby is an argument we often see and hear about on this forum, and it sounds to me like he's trying to pass on the guilt trip that someone else has been laying on him. Do you know if mom and/or dad have been pressuring him/wife in more hands-on caregiving than they are willing to do?

If your brother has been doing hand-on caregiving and is now hovering near burnout, and if he's taking his anger out on you, albeit unfairly, that might be what your next conversation with him should be about. If he feels like he's stuck on this hamster wheel - and there are many of us here who have been in that exact situation - he might need someone to vent to, and someone to help give him other solutions or ideas on dealing with 2 elderly parents, at least one of whom clearly has some sort of cognitive decline. He needs to be told - and to come to terms with the idea -that he does indeed have other options if he no longer wishes to do what he's doing.

Good luck!

Know what I think? Everyone is upset that their mom/wife/loved one is incontinent. THAT is the core matter that is getting everyone worked up into a tizzy in the first place. The fact that a mop and pail is necessary drives home the fact that mom is peeing all over the house. They are responding to THAT, and taking it out on YOU.

Mom needs to wear Depends adult briefs so these 'accidents' can be contained and so that she & everyone else won't have to suffer the indignity of 'embarrassment' on her behalf or on behalf of themselves. So that the 'accidents' won't happen anymore, plain & simple.

An open & honest discussion of The Facts needs to happen. The elephant in the room isn't going away b/c it's a touchy subject or b/c it creates the uncomfortable 'embarrassment' that nobody's happy with.

You know what they say about Denial? It's not just a river in Egypt.

Elders love to fight off the fact that they need to wear adult briefs in general. My mother did. She was about 89 years old & my DH & I had just taken her out to dinner. She was having a lot of trouble with urgency; the ability to 'hold it in' was getting tougher and tougher as the days went on. After dinner, she & I were in the elevator riding up to her apt in the ALF she lived in. Right then & there she peed. Fully and completely b/c she could not hold it in at all. There was urine running down her legs and all over the carpet in the elevator. She about had a cow. She was mortified and swore to God right then & there she'd start wearing Depends. And she did. She's 94.5 now and still wearing Depends.

It's time for all the 'adults' to talk about what's happening with mom, and how it's nobody's 'fault' that she's incontinent or that clean up's need to happen, one way or another. And how will you all be able to make mom understand it's time to wear adult briefs now, for everyone's sake, so she can go out in public and feel secure.

Good luck

No, you aren't missing anything. THEY are.
They came with an incontinent woman to a home, and didn't protect that home by having the incontinent woman wear the appropriate underthings to prevent accidents in your home. I cannot see that you did anything wrong. I cannot imagine the condition of their home. And I would not have them back in these circumstances.

Dear Keepthepeace, I’m sorry but your dad nor brother should be ok with your mom peeing all over the place. If they didn’t want you cleaning up after her then they should.
They do make women’s. pull-ups that look like very nice underwear.
Either your mom has dementia or she has something wrong with her bladder. Your dad needs to quit covering up for her and get her some help. Nobody likes to wear pull-ups or diapers but I know I’d rather do that than embarrass my family.

Your user name says it all.

Stop trying to "keep the peace". Your mom needs more care than she is currently receiving.

The fact that that's not the conversation tells me that they are trying to use this trip as a diversionary tactic.