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It seems to be generational. It seems as though most elderly people DO expect their children to take complete care of them. That is one of the reasons that people had children back then. That was the expectation.

But now, almost every adult that I speak with in my caregiver groups all say that they would NOT expect their children to take care of them, and that they would not want to be a burden to their children.

Some are even planning measures to end their life, if it comes to that.
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Davenport Sep 2020
Amen! Yes, us gens know that we shouldn't expect or burden our children with caring for us. It's not cruel or harsh, it's being 'grown up', accepting the reality that every human being will die, and refusing to live in fear of that inevitable fact. And yes, I, too, am planning measures to end my life, if it 'comes to that'. I believe it's the responsible thing to do. I know and accept that I can't control how that may play out. I don't have the desire or means to keep this earth suit limping along past its natural time.
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Not generational. You have to take care of yourself first. Just give up on the idea that you owe your mother any more than you have already given. She is in a good place and and can get all her actual, not perceived, needs taken care of where she is. Share with management at her facility your situation health wise and explain that your ability to meet all her demands are limited. Follow the advice of others here regarding how to respond to mom. She may forget, purposefully or not, about YOUR health needs, so remind her if you have to. But dont get drawn into long discussion or argument about that or anything else. Be frm. When it is time to end a phone conversation, tell her you have to go and hang up. Im a 3 time cancer survivor. Know how tough it can be even under the best of circumstances. Wish you the best!
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Davenport Sep 2020
Hi, Dosmo13. I think your ideas are sound and true, and I agree completely. I disagree and think that it is fundamentally 'generational'. I wrote a bit ago about my perception of being a primary caretaker at 65+ earlier. I believe it IS generational: my mom never learned or saw modeled or suggested that she might take care of herself so as to not burden her children; it was a different time, everything was completely different in her life. I grew up with the message that not burdening anyone with my life in any way in their own lives is compassion and strength, which concept my mom was never exposed to, being born in 1929. Again, I'm all in with everything else you shared! Thanks everyone here for your sharing and support.
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Every person should sit down and plan out their end of life desires. Do not place that burden on your children. Draw up advance directives, DNR, Power of Attorney, etc. NOW. If you are young enough for it to help, get a life care insurance policy that will pay for your assisted living. Do not count on Social Security, Medicare, etc. for your future, make plans now.
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Davenport Sep 2020
YES!!! I never thought about a life insurance policy because I have no one financially dependent on me. I never knew that I could be my own beneficiary! I'd have gotten one when I was 40ish if I'd known that! I do have long term care insurance for 25 years now, but it's so complicated and has so many requirements and exceptions, and interacting with Medicare, that I have had to hire an elder law attorney to understand it and activate it when I need it.
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As a 'baby boomer' I know firsthand that I and my 2 older & younger sisters, in our 60s and 70s, are doing this work. My om is in her 90s, and was born in 1929 when people in the U.S. didn't ever think about 'this stuff' since folks didn't normally live past 75-80. When my dad died 25 years ago, he left mom with total financial security, including staying in her home indefinitely. Finances aside, she refuses to leave that house and wants (understandably) to die at home. Except that, at 90+, she can't appreciate that her 60-70+ y/o 'children' are struggling mightily to enable her to maintain that ideal fantasy, both physically and in all other manner--medical care, financial management, babysitting care, obtaining food and cooking care, and in Covid times, physically cleaning her (our) house. The psychological toll will be permanent on all of us. "Who will take care of us?" At 66, I'm the only one of 3 that is in serious need of financial support; and what would have been my dad's wish to provide me with basic living support; I'm situated that I'm considering how to live in my car. I've never expected nor telegraphed to my children that they might be burdened with my geriatric (physical or mental) care and decisions. I will leave no estate or financial legacy, but I've scrapped to save a few thousand $$ for an elder law and estate attorney to set everything up legally so that none of them will have to experience what my mom's 3 kids have. Who will take care of us? Ourselves. It's the only mature, loving, and practical thing to do. It's hard and scary and painful as heck (I don't relish being a body in any sort of medical or nursing facility, and pray I'll never be there), but honestly, I've been through a lot worse in my 66 years; it'll just be another challenge of being a human being. My challenge is "can I be more compassionate than my fear?". My heart, while I'm still fairly lucid, chooses compassion.

My mom has every 'right' to 'complain' about not getting her hair colored, given the context of her life. It's not that she's a selfish, icky person. As a 66 y/o caregiver, I have the gift of understanding of her life experiences and expectations. It's a bitch, I don't like it one bit, but I will survive and learn. I'm reminded of 'the Greatest Generation'. I respect and thank my ancestors, but well, we're actively doing that same degree and challenge of 'work', (working through fear and struggle) without historic precedent. We are the Sandwich Generation. We are strong and brave. I thank this forum for allowing me to write and post here, and in so doing, share, process and affirm my lived experience. I send love and support to us all.
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I learned too late in life and thank god I did learn. If people do NOT treat you well, consider them dead and stay away from them. You owe them nothing - ever - no matter who or what the relationship is. Take care of yourself as no one else is going to do so. If you can't escape them, then get tough and let them have it in such a way they learn never to mess with you again. I wish I had gotten that into me long ago as then I would not have suffered so much - but no more. Now I fight back and don't tolerate crap from anyone.
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disgustedtoo Sep 2020
No wonder you have no one left in your life to perhaps bring you some joy. I wouldn't treat you badly, but with that attitude, you wouldn't see me either!
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Im hoping dr assisted suicide will be available in my state by the time im old and sickly
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NeedHelpWithMom Sep 2020
I want to go to sleep and not wake up while having a beautiful dream as my end. I suppose that is asking for a bit too much! LOL It’s a nice thought, isn’t it?
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Welcome to my world. I pulled my mother out of her retirement community when covid hit and now I spend 2 weeks in her big old hoarder house in Tucson and 2 weeks in San Diego trying to take care of my house. I always wondered why I ended up married to narcissistic husbands. It turns out that my mother was the person who conditioned me to accept it as "normal". Now I am sort of temporarily trapped with her and waiting on her all day. I applaud you for the courage to sell her house and keep your own life.

I have found that the most effective response I can give to her complaints and demands (after months of not handling things too well, is "I am sorry you feel that way and I wish there was something that could be done about it. Unfortunately, right now, there is nothing that can be done." And, then, because she has dementia, I ask a question that totally changes the subject.

I used to own a senior residential care home so I have spent a lot more time than most people thinking about my "old age". I agree with you that I won't be a burden to my children if I can help it. I have had a long term care policy for years. In my experience some older people are very sweet and considerate and easy to care for while others are just miserable and demanding. We just have to be careful not to think that we are going to fix their personality by trying to fix their problems. I have considered this year as an opportunity to learn how to set boundaries with my mother and to focus on balancing caring for her with self care so I don't become too resentful. It is just hard to get old. There is no getting around it and having seen what I have seen I hope to plan ahead and not be surprised when I wake up one day and realize I am old. Although I did wake up one day shocked that I am now considered a senior citizen. I sure don't feel like one yet. LOL
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The mix of strong pain killers before a swim in one the most dangerous surf beaches in the state seems to work. I imagine quite a quick pain-free end. Although the gentleman was never found... could have met with a shark before the pain meds kicked in...

I'm not sure I could make such a plan but I suppose I could take up surfing in my 80's & let fate take over.
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Dosmo13 Sep 2020
Ha, ha. Very clever. IF you can take up surfing in your 80's! Better start your planning now (though I'm not endorsing your plan!) I've found that in my 80's it not easy to "take up" anything. More and more your life is dictated by circumstances. It's adapt, adapt, adapt the best you can and try to remain pleasant enough that others don't consider just an old grouch.
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I like this thread and the many good ideas. Thanks Comingtoterms for starting this.

I am in the middle of reading "Final Gifts: Understanding and Helping the Dying," written by two hospice nurses, a very intriguing book. Someone in this forum suggested it. Thank you. The common theme so far in the book is that many dying people see dead loved ones or angels before they die. That includes people of faiths and atheists. They saw what lay ahead for them when they leave the physical world.

It is a confirmation for me as I do believe that our bodies die, and our souls transition to another dimension.

My ideal death would be to have my loved ones from both sides next to me, one side waiting and welcoming, one side saying good byes for now, as my doctor assists me to transition from one plane to the next. Why can't the law accommodate people to have a peaceful exit? That would be so humane.
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NeedHelpWithMom Oct 2020
Amen!
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If earaches and a sore knee are your mother's only problems, what forced her to move from her home to an ALF? In what sense is this about end-of-life care?

86 is nothing. I have a 99 year old lady (who I would quite like to adopt as my own granny because she is a complete sweetie-pie) on tonight's round who is still managing in her own home. We visit three times a day to help with her medication and check she's okay, because her eyesight is not so good now and her hands aren't as strong as they were. Her bed call is at twenty to eight but most days you'll find she's already undressed, cleaned her teeth, and got into bed by herself; although one evening she'd curled up on her sofa and fallen asleep like a little dormouse. She was worn out because she'd been taken into town for lunch that day, and told me proudly that she'd put on a facemask for the first time in her life!

Generational thing... As it happens, this lady lives in an almshouse, a comparatively modern one with "1808" carved on the keystone over the gate. There are a few of them in our city: communities of little houses built 200, 300 or in one case nearly 500 years ago for pensioned-off servants, old clergymen, the aged and infirm who had no families able to look after them. They were founded and paid for by the church, other charitable foundations or local philanthropists. They still function beautifully as retirement properties.

In Anthony Trollope's book 'The Warden' there is a character who lives in such an almshouse, impoverished after a prosperous life's work because his children conned him out of his money and left him neglected and helpless. 1855, that book was published.

So no, I don't think the issues of aging ever really change.
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My father was born in 1899. He and my mother were both only children and, as expected, took responsibility for the care of their elderly parents. One elderly grandmother of mine lived with us for almost my entire early childhood. She mothered me more than my biological mom would have. She was fairly able until the end, but died suddenly and peacefully.
The other grandparents remained for years in their own nearby home with combo of family and caregiver help. Eventually, they had short-term need of what would today be considered "hospice"care. I was never aware of any family hardship or resentment over of this.

It may have had more effect than I was aware of, however, because my parents were determined never to be dependent on their children. They made foresighted financial decisions. I offered to let my widowed father live with me when he needed care (I am a nurse and was unmarried). Both my brothers pressured him to agree. It was an easy solution for them. They were too busy to offer anything but advice during my mothers final days.
It might have kept my father out of a nursing home and he knew it, but he adamantly, and repeatedly, refused my offer. God love him! He said he did not want to interfere with any plans I might have for my future and my career. I will always love and admire him for this.
So yes, family expectations may be somewhat generational, but not always. Not entirely. Sometimes it is more a matter of individual character.
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I wrote about my father born in 1899. Think the post was mis-attributed and maybe wrongly placed. My fault, somehow, I know. (I'm dosmo13, not whoever the post was originally attributed to)

I just wanted to make the point that though my father lived almost an entire century, he deliberately departed from the expected elder-care pattern of his day. He cared for his own elderly parents and in-laws, but willingly gave up his own comfort in old age for a daughter that he loved. He was not a perfect father, but I wanted to somehow give tribute to his unselfishness.
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Perhaps it’s not generational so much as healthcare has extended the lives of our parents generation much more than previous ones have experienced. When Social Security was established in the 1930’s most people died in their 60’s or early 70’s. Now it’s routine to live into your 90’s. My 93 year old mom has an older sister and just lost a brother aged 99!

It seems that with a shorter life expectancy people really didn’t take care of themselves the way we do now at the same age. My parents never exercised while I swim daily and walk daily.

Also, 50 years ago senior housing was often the dire "old folks home" of my parents nightmare. The last refuge of the impoverished. I have spent a lot of time recently researching AL for Mom and there are some very nice places out there!

The Boomer generation is definitely changing the face of retirement communities. Yes, it can be expensive but why not spend your hard earned savings on yourself? I have never understood people wanting to "leave something to the kids." I have worked and saved since I was 15 and figure to spend it on my own care rather than expect my family or the state to pay.

Mom told me years ago that she did not want her kids to have to take care of her the way her sister did their mom who was widowed early and received a $63 a month railway pension. Mom saw what a toll it took on my aunt and didn’t want us to go thru that.

I am 66, no spouse or kids. After 5 years of dealing with my parents health and financial issues I have started the process of eliminating my own "stuff" with the anticipation of moving into senior living at some point. I don’t want, or expect, anyone to have to clear out 50+ years of accumulated clutter. I have also started to look for my next home, low maintenance and accessible when needed.


I also hope that in 30 or 40 years society will allow me to choose to end my life as and when I want to, no one should be forced to endure the indignity of a miserable old age.
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I think that I will go skydiving and not pull the cord. Beautiful view on my way out.
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I've definitely thought about this, and there is no way in the world I will ever live with my son, or depend on him for my care. No way will I ever burden him as I have been burdened.

If I get dementia, and/or can no longer care for myself then I am going to put my final affairs in order, take a bunch of pills sure to do the job and go to sleep, forever.
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This is why I wish that assisted suicide was available to all of us. When quality of life is gone forever, life can become a burden.

Most people can get through something if it is only temporary. When it is ongoing therein lies a huge problem!

It is extremely controversial for many and will not grow in popularity quickly. At least it is available in some states.

Properly managed, I feel that assisted suicide could be blessing for so many.
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